odd PH/VMS logical name behaviour

Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:08:36 -0500

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I'm trying to do too many things at once here - never name the logical name
the same as the value or the heading will confuse you.... sigh. You are
correct, if you define the logical name in mixed case, we upshift it and
will not see it since we don't do a case_blind search with trnlnm. If I use
Gavins test case I see the value set by the unquoted gav only.  Sorry for
the confusion.  

Allison Hamilton

-----Original Message-----
From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com
[mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com]On Behalf Of Lloyd, Gavin
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 3:50 PM
To: Chris Sharman; Hamilton, Allison
Cc: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com; doug.moffatt@cognos.com
Subject: RE: odd PH/VMS logical name behaviour

We've got OpenVMS V7.1-2 and I tried your code and it reported blank in
quiz (i.e. did not get logical value).

FYI - All our logicals are declared without the speechmarks (e.g. DEFINE
LOG VAL not DEFINE "LOG" "VAL") which uppercases everything - so no
problems.

Did a small test as well if that helps:

<---------------------
DCL> def gav gavval
DCL> def "Gav" gavval2
DCL> sho log G*   

(LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)

  "GAV" = "GAVVAL"
  "Gav" = "GAVVAL2"
---------------------->

Regards,
Gavin Lloyd - FM Global.

-----Original Message-----
From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com
[mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sharman
Sent: 10 March 2004 17:11
To: Hamilton, Allison
Cc: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com; doug.moffatt@cognos.com
Subject: Re: odd PH/VMS logical name behaviour

Hamilton, Allison wrote:
> Chris,  I think this may be a difference in behaviour between 7.2 and
> 7.3 of OpenVMS because I tried this in 7.10G3, 7.10G5 and 8.30D4 (all
on 
> 6.2 of OpenVMS) and 8.40D on 7.2-1 and 8.40D on 7.2-2 of OpenVMS and 
> they retrieve the value of Test correctly.  I don't have a 7.3 OpenVMS

> system available to me yet, so I can't test it there.  Perhaps there
is 
> a setting on the logical or in your environment that would affect the 
> default behaviour of the logical translation function (trnlnm) that is

> available in 7.3???
> 
> I know that OpenVMS is moving more and more into the Posix world which
> requires case sensitivity, so more things behave somewhat differently.

> I don't know if this one is an intentional change or not on the part
of 
> OpenVMS.  Usually they don't change the default behaviour of things so

> drastically, but who knows.

Curious. Nothing I'm aware of - DCL has always uppercased everything, 
and still does, unless you enable the mixed-case behaviour which goes 
with the ODS5 file system, which we haven't.

> Prior to 7.3 retrieval using uppercase always retrieved the correct
> value due to the basically uppercase or case insensitive nature of the

> VMS environment.  PowerHouse is built with this assumption currently, 
> and generally upcases just about everything coming in to ensure it can

> find it.

sys$trnlnm (and lib$get_logical) have always had a LNM$M_CASE_BLIND 
option, but it has never been the default behaviour, and still isn't.
DCL f$trnlnm offers case-blind by default, and case-sensitive 
optionally. The older (obsolete since about V5) sys$trnlog and 
associated lib$ routine may do case-blind by default - I don't recall.

I don't think VMS has ever seen a non-compatible system service change 
like you suggest.
Anyone got access to VMS 7.3 and an earlier version to confirm/deny ?

> Allison Hamilton
> Senior Software Engineer
> Cognos Inc.
> Any opinions expressed within this message are mine alone and my
> employer cannot be held accountable for them  :-}
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com 
> [mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com]On Behalf Of Chris Sharman
> Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 6:30 AM
> To: PowerH List
> Subject: odd PH/VMS logical name behaviour
> 
> 
> I've got a mixed-case logical name:
> $ def "Test" "MyTest"
> 
> $ quiz
> Qz> def mytest char*10 = getsystemval("Test")
> Qz> rep mytest
> 
> Reports it as blank - presumably it doesn't find it.
> Defining it as uppercase works fine.
> 
> VMS logical names can be defined mixed-case (but are usually 
> uppercase). They can be fetched either case-sensitive or case-blind.
> 
> Powerhouse would appear to be uppercasing the supplied string, then 
> doing a case-sensitive search - not the optimum behaviour ! Be nice if

> it used the string I gave it, and probably set the case-blind flag to 
> avoid breaking most existing stuff.
> 
> VMS 7.3, PH 7.10G3

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<TITLE>RE: odd PH/VMS logical name behaviour</TITLE>
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I'm trying to do too many things at once here - never =
name the logical name the same as the value or the heading will confuse =
you.... sigh. You are correct, if you define the logical name in mixed =
case, we upshift it and will not see it since we don't do a case_blind =
search with trnlnm. If I use Gavins test case I see the value set by =
the unquoted gav only.&nbsp; Sorry for the confusion.&nbsp;

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Allison Hamilton</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>-----Original Message-----</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>[<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com">mailto:powerh-l-admin@li=
sts.sowder.com</A>]On Behalf Of Lloyd, Gavin</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 3:50 PM</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>To: Chris Sharman; Hamilton, Allison</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Cc: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com; =
doug.moffatt@cognos.com</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Subject: RE: odd PH/VMS logical name =
behaviour</FONT>
</P>
<BR>

We've got OpenVMS V7.1-2 and I tried your code and it =
reported blank in
 quiz (i.e. did not get logical value).

FYI - All our logicals are declared without the =
speechmarks (e.g. DEFINE
 LOG VAL not DEFINE &quot;LOG&quot; &quot;VAL&quot;) =
which uppercases everything - so no
 problems.

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Did a small test as well if that helps:</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&lt;---------------------</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>DCL&gt; def gav gavval</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>DCL&gt; def &quot;Gav&quot; gavval2</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>DCL&gt; sho log G*&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>(LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&nbsp; &quot;GAV&quot; =3D &quot;GAVVAL&quot;</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&nbsp; &quot;Gav&quot; =3D =
&quot;GAVVAL2&quot;</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>----------------------&gt;</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Regards,</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Gavin Lloyd - FM Global.</FONT>
</P>
<BR>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>-----Original Message-----</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>[<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com">mailto:powerh-l-admin@li=
sts.sowder.com</A>] On Behalf Of Chris Sharman</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Sent: 10 March 2004 17:11</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>To: Hamilton, Allison</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Cc: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com; =
doug.moffatt@cognos.com</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Subject: Re: odd PH/VMS logical name =
behaviour</FONT>
</P>
<BR>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Hamilton, Allison wrote:</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; Chris,&nbsp; I think this may be a difference =
in behaviour between 7.2 and</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; 7.3 of OpenVMS because I tried this in 7.10G3, =
7.10G5 and 8.30D4 (all</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>on </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; 6.2 of OpenVMS) and 8.40D on 7.2-1 and 8.40D on =
7.2-2 of OpenVMS and </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; they retrieve the value of Test =
correctly.&nbsp; I don't have a 7.3 OpenVMS</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; system available to me yet, so I can't test it =
there.&nbsp; Perhaps there</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>is </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; a setting on the logical or in your environment =
that would affect the </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; default behaviour of the logical translation =
function (trnlnm) that is</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; available in 7.3???</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; I know that OpenVMS is moving more and more =
into the Posix world which</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; requires case sensitivity, so more things =
behave somewhat differently.</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; I don't know if this one is an intentional =
change or not on the part</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>of </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; OpenVMS.&nbsp; Usually they don't change the =
default behaviour of things so</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; drastically, but who knows.</FONT>
</P>

Curious. Nothing I'm aware of - DCL has always =
uppercased everything, 
 and still does, unless you enable the mixed-case =
behaviour which goes 
 with the ODS5 file system, which we haven't.

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; Prior to 7.3 retrieval using uppercase always =
retrieved the correct</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; value due to the basically uppercase or case =
insensitive nature of the</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; VMS environment.&nbsp; PowerHouse is built with =
this assumption currently, </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; and generally upcases just about everything =
coming in to ensure it can</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; find it.</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>sys$trnlnm (and lib$get_logical) have always had a =
LNM$M_CASE_BLIND </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>option, but it has never been the default behaviour, =
and still isn't.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>DCL f$trnlnm offers case-blind by default, and =
case-sensitive </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>optionally. The older (obsolete since about V5) =
sys$trnlog and </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>associated lib$ routine may do case-blind by default =
- I don't recall.</FONT>
</P>

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>I don't think VMS has ever seen a non-compatible =
system service change </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>like you suggest.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Anyone got access to VMS 7.3 and an earlier version =
to confirm/deny ?</FONT>
</P>

&gt; Allison Hamilton
 &gt; Senior Software Engineer
 &gt; Cognos Inc.
 &gt; Any opinions expressed within this message are =
mine alone and my
 &gt; employer cannot be held accountable for =
them&nbsp; :-}
 &gt; 
 &gt; -----Original Message-----
 &gt; From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com 
 &gt; [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com">mailto:powerh-l-admin@li=
sts.sowder.com</A>]On Behalf Of Chris Sharman
 &gt; Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 6:30 AM
 &gt; To: PowerH List
 &gt; Subject: odd PH/VMS logical name =
behaviour
 &gt; 
 &gt; 
 &gt; I've got a mixed-case logical name:
 &gt; $ def &quot;Test&quot; =
&quot;MyTest&quot;
 &gt; 
 &gt; $ quiz
 &gt; Qz&gt; def mytest char*10 =3D =
getsystemval(&quot;Test&quot;)
 &gt; Qz&gt; rep mytest
 &gt; 
 &gt; Reports it as blank - presumably it doesn't =
find it.
 &gt; Defining it as uppercase works fine.
 &gt; 
 &gt; VMS logical names can be defined mixed-case =
(but are usually 
 &gt; uppercase). They can be fetched either =
case-sensitive or case-blind.
 &gt; 
 &gt; Powerhouse would appear to be uppercasing the =
supplied string, then 
 &gt; doing a case-sensitive search - not the optimum =
behaviour ! Be nice if

<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; it used the string I gave it, and probably set =
the case-blind flag to </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; avoid breaking most existing stuff.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; VMS 7.3, PH 7.10G3</FONT>
</P>
<BR>

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