Fw: Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or Windows
Deskin, Bob
Bob.Deskin@Cognos.COM
Mon, 26 Apr 2004 08:56:44 -0400
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Just to verify Joe's comment, the just-shipped PowerHouse 8.43D supports =
"large files" for C-ISAM. This means that it supports up to 2 Gig =
records but the number of bytes can be much more than 2 Gig. PowerHouse =
does not put a limit on the maximum file size, only the number of =
records it can handle.
Bob Deskin =20
Senior Product Manager, Application Development Tools, Cognos Inc.=20
bob.deskin@cognos.com (613) 738-1338 ext 7268 FAX: (613) 727-1178=20
3755 Riverside Drive P.O. Box 9707 Stn. T, Ottawa ON K1G 4K9 CANADA=20
-----Original Message-----
From: powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com =
[mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com] On Behalf Of Joe Boyle
Sent: April 26, 2004 7:26 AM
To: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com
Subject: RE: Fw: Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or =
Windows
=09
=09
and to all those that were irritated by the 2 Giga byte file size limit =
for C-isam - I'm almost certain that with the new PH versions, the file =
size is now limited to 2-Gig records of whatever byte size.
=09
>From: "Philip Jackson" <pj@icing-it.co.uk>=20
>To: <powerh-l@lists.sowder.com>=20
>Subject: Fw: Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or =
Windows=20
>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:32:43 +0100=20
>=20
>Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or WindowsI have =
just finished helping a client move several applications from =
HP3000/TurboIMAGE to HP-UX & C-ISAM.=20
>=20
>We looked at moving to Oracle on HP-UX, but discounted it mainly =
because the primary application relied heavily on arrays and =
substructures - things that don't fit easily into a relational system. =
If we had been starting a new application then Oracle would probably =
have been used as the database, but the port was much easier from Image =
to C-ISAM. We didn't look at Eloquence as I don't think it was even in =
beta-test at the time we were looking at options.=20
>=20
>The majority of the code moved over smoothly. Most recompiled without =
problems, and most PowerHouse code changes were to do with the order =
records were retrieved.=20
>=20
>We did discover that several of our QTPs accidently created duplicate =
unique keys briefly while updating due to the order of updates - Image =
doesn't enforce unique keys on detail datasets so it never caused a =
problem before, whereas C-ISAM does it properly and would crash the QTP. =
However it was simple to fix once we figured out what was causing it.=20
>=20
>Our biggest changes were, as you would expect, relating to interaction =
with the OS for things like printing and streaming jobs. I would =
recommend that you investigate the running/creating of scripts/jobs on =
the fly (if you do that) very carefully.=20
>=20
>The HP-UX machine runs about twenty (thats 20) times faster! - of =
course it's a completely different type of machine and more powerful, =
but the speed increase was almost incidental and impressed even the most =
demanding users. In fact sometimes it was difficult to convince the =
users that the jobs that usually would take, say, 20 minutes to run were =
completed and printing in under a minute.=20
>=20
>If you do anything at all fancy with printing, unix will fight you all =
the way. There is no inbuilt way to print a range of pages, or part of =
a file, or even resuming a jammed printout back a bit without cancelling =
and resubmitting the print. While it does nice banner pages and is fine =
for printouts that, well, just print and don't jam, adding a new printer =
for example stops and restarts all print jobs currently printing from =
the beginning (or if you're lucky just stops them). We tried a couple =
of third-party spooling products but quite frankly they were relying on =
a greater depth of knowledge of networks and unix than we had or wanted, =
and were really aimed at a mixed os printing environment. A few things =
were better, but by-in-large I consider printer handling on HP-UX =
'incomplete'.=20
>=20
>Some of the more advanced users were used to using various line =
editors to write their own quizes. There was no way they could have =
handled vi on HP-UX - even some of the non-unix programmers spent days =
laughing hysterically over it - so we bought the new Qedit for HP-UX for =
them. There were other ways we could have done it - perhaps having =
shares on the unix boxes mapped in Windows so that they could have used =
Notepad or any other windows editor instead - but it was decided this =
was a better fit. And it helped some of the programmers too who were =
already feeling unloved by unix.=20
>=20
>The standard users wouldn't have noticed the difference between it =
running on HP3000 or HP-UX, if it wasn't for the enormous speed =
increase. Quick screens handle just about identically, and they even =
continued using the same terminal emulators.=20
>=20
>=20
>Hope this answers some of your questions, and reassures anyone else =
looking at doing PowerHouse HP3000 to HP-UX.=20
>=20
>Can't advise with porting to PowerHouse on Windows, and as for =
converting to Cobol / Java, that would be a re-write rather than a =
'simple' port and therefore quite a different type of project. Maybe if =
you were going to be replacing an old PowerHouse application that no =
longer suited the business with a brand new =
better-stronger-faster-differently-featured one and you didn't want to =
stay with PowerHouse (shame!) then using a completely different language =
would make sense. But I can't see that porting between such very =
different languages would be a good use of your time and effort.=20
>=20
>=20
>Philip.=20
>=20
>----- Original Message -----=20
> From: Fritsch, Peter-Robert=20
> To: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com=20
> Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 10:54 AM=20
> Subject: Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or =
Windows=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Hi, what is the best way to port/migrate/run PowerHouse =
applications (with TurboIMAGE) from a HP 3000 / MPE to UNIX or Windows =
Servers.=20
>=20
> Are there runtimes for Powerhouse on UNIX or Windows, which can be =
used for the applications developed for HP3000.=20
> Are there porting or migration tools from PowerHouse to COBOL / =
JAVA.=20
>=20
> What is the best way for the exchange of the environment, whereby =
the applications should be still working under UNIX or Windows.=20
>=20
> Thanks a lot, regards Peter=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Ing. Mag. Peter Robert Fritsch=20
> Account Manager=20
> Gesch=E4ftsfeld Informatik=20
>=20
> Tel.: +43 1 797 50-231=20
> Fax: +43 1 797 50-8008=20
> Mobil: +43 676 765 66 31=20
> Email: peter-robert.fritsch@beko.at=20
>=20
> BEKO Ing. P. Kotauczek GmbH=20
> A-1030 Wien=20
> Modecenterstra=DFe 22/A1/6=20
> www.beko-informatik.com=20
>=20
>=20
________________________________
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><DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D649555312-26042004><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Just=20
to verify Joe's comment, the just-shipped PowerHouse 8.43D supports =
"large=20
files" for C-ISAM. This means that it supports up to 2 Gig records but =
the=20
number of bytes can be much more than 2 Gig. PowerHouse does not put a =
limit on=20
the maximum file size, only the number of records it can=20
handle.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D649555312-26042004><!-- Converted from text/rtf =
format -->
<P><SPAN lang=3Den-us><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Bob=20
Deskin &=
nbsp; =20
</FONT></SPAN><BR><SPAN lang=3Den-us><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Senior =
Product=20
Manager, Application Development Tools, Cognos Inc.</FONT></SPAN> =
<BR><SPAN=20
lang=3Den-us><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>bob.deskin@cognos.com (613) =
738-1338 ext 7268=20
FAX: (613) 727-1178</FONT></SPAN> <BR><SPAN lang=3Den-us><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>3755 Riverside Drive P.O. Box 9707 Stn. T, Ottawa ON K1G 4K9=20
CANADA</FONT></SPAN> </P></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr =
align=3Dleft><FONT=20
face=3DTahoma size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com =
[mailto:powerh-l-admin@lists.sowder.com] <B>On=20
Behalf Of </B>Joe Boyle<BR><B>Sent:</B> April 26, 2004 7:26 =
AM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
powerh-l@lists.sowder.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: Fw: Powerhouse - =
migrate/port=20
from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or Windows<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=3DRTE>
<P>and to all those that were irritated by the 2 Giga byte file size =
limit for=20
C-isam - I'm almost certain that with the new PH versions, the =
file=20
size is now limited to 2-Gig records of whatever byte =
size.<BR></P></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>>From: "Philip Jackson" <pj@icing-it.co.uk>=20
<DIV></DIV>>To: <powerh-l@lists.sowder.com>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Subject: Fw: Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE =
to UNIX=20
or Windows=20
<DIV></DIV>>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:32:43 +0100=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Powerhouse - migrate/port from HP3000 MPE to UNIX or =
WindowsI=20
have just finished helping a client move several applications from=20
HP3000/TurboIMAGE to HP-UX & C-ISAM.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>We looked at moving to Oracle on HP-UX, but discounted =
it=20
mainly because the primary application relied heavily on arrays and=20
substructures - things that don't fit easily into a relational=20
system. If we had been starting a new application then =
Oracle would=20
probably have been used as the database, but the port was much easier =
from=20
Image to C-ISAM. We didn't look at Eloquence as I don't =
think it=20
was even in beta-test at the time we were looking at options.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>The majority of the code moved over =
smoothly. Most=20
recompiled without problems, and most PowerHouse code changes were to =
do with=20
the order records were retrieved.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>We did discover that several of our QTPs accidently =
created=20
duplicate unique keys briefly while updating due to the order of =
updates -=20
Image doesn't enforce unique keys on detail datasets so it never =
caused a=20
problem before, whereas C-ISAM does it properly and would crash the=20
QTP. However it was simple to fix once we figured out what =
was=20
causing it.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Our biggest changes were, as you would expect, relating =
to=20
interaction with the OS for things like printing and streaming=20
jobs. I would recommend that you investigate the =
running/creating=20
of scripts/jobs on the fly (if you do that) very carefully.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>The HP-UX machine runs about twenty (thats 20) times =
faster! -=20
of course it's a completely different type of machine and more =
powerful, but=20
the speed increase was almost incidental and impressed even the most =
demanding=20
users. In fact sometimes it was difficult to convince the =
users=20
that the jobs that usually would take, say, 20 minutes to run were =
completed=20
and printing in under a minute.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>If you do anything at all fancy with printing, unix =
will fight=20
you all the way. There is no inbuilt way to print a range =
of pages,=20
or part of a file, or even resuming a jammed printout back a bit =
without=20
cancelling and resubmitting the print. While it does nice =
banner=20
pages and is fine for printouts that, well, just print and don't jam, =
adding a=20
new printer for example stops and restarts all print jobs currently =
printing=20
from the beginning (or if you're lucky just stops them). We =
tried a=20
couple of third-party spooling products but quite frankly they were =
relying on=20
a greater depth of knowledge of networks and unix than we had or =
wanted, and=20
were really aimed at a mixed os printing environment. A few =
things=20
were better, but by-in-large I consider printer handling on HP-UX=20
'incomplete'.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Some of the more advanced users were used to using =
various line=20
editors to write their own quizes. There was no way they =
could have=20
handled vi on HP-UX - even some of the non-unix programmers spent days =
laughing hysterically over it - so we bought the new Qedit for HP-UX =
for=20
them. There were other ways we could have done it - perhaps =
having=20
shares on the unix boxes mapped in Windows so that they could have =
used=20
Notepad or any other windows editor instead - but it was decided this =
was a=20
better fit. And it helped some of the programmers too who =
were=20
already feeling unloved by unix.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>The standard users wouldn't have noticed the difference =
between=20
it running on HP3000 or HP-UX, if it wasn't for the enormous speed=20
increase. Quick screens handle just about identically, and =
they=20
even continued using the same terminal emulators.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Hope this answers some of your questions, and reassures =
anyone=20
else looking at doing PowerHouse HP3000 to HP-UX.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Can't advise with porting to PowerHouse on Windows, and =
as for=20
converting to Cobol / Java, that would be a re-write rather than a =
'simple'=20
port and therefore quite a different type of project. Maybe =
if you=20
were going to be replacing an old PowerHouse application that no =
longer suited=20
the business with a brand new =
better-stronger-faster-differently-featured one=20
and you didn't want to stay with PowerHouse (shame!) then using a =
completely=20
different language would make sense. But I can't see that =
porting=20
between such very different languages would be a good use of your time =
and=20
effort.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>Philip.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>----- Original Message -----=20
<DIV></DIV>> From: Fritsch, Peter-Robert=20
<DIV></DIV>> To: powerh-l@lists.sowder.com=20
<DIV></DIV>> Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 10:54 AM=20
<DIV></DIV>> Subject: Powerhouse - migrate/port from =
HP3000 MPE=20
to UNIX or Windows=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> Hi, what is the best way to =
port/migrate/run=20
PowerHouse applications (with TurboIMAGE) from a HP 3000 / MPE to UNIX =
or=20
Windows Servers.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> Are there runtimes for Powerhouse on UNIX =
or=20
Windows, which can be used for the applications developed for HP3000.=20
<DIV></DIV>> Are there porting or migration tools from=20
PowerHouse to COBOL / JAVA.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> What is the best way for the exchange of =
the=20
environment, whereby the applications should be still working under =
UNIX or=20
Windows.=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> Thanks a lot, regards Peter=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> Ing. Mag. Peter Robert Fritsch=20
<DIV></DIV>> Account Manager=20
<DIV></DIV>> Gesch=E4ftsfeld Informatik=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> Tel.: +43 1 797 =
50-231=20
<DIV></DIV>> Fax: +43 1 797 =
50-8008=20
<DIV></DIV>> Mobil: +43 676 765 66 31=20
<DIV></DIV>> =
Email: peter-robert.fritsch@beko.at=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>> BEKO Ing. P. Kotauczek GmbH=20
<DIV></DIV>> A-1030 Wien=20
<DIV></DIV>> Modecenterstra=DFe 22/A1/6=20
<DIV></DIV>> www.beko-informatik.com=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV>>=20
<DIV></DIV></DIV><BR clear=3Dall>
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Get a free connection, half-price modem and one month FREE, when you =
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<P> <B><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" =
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from top analysts. Learn from the Cognos Business Intelligence and =
Enterprise Planning gurus. And turn your potential into higher =
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